Thursday, February 06, 2014

"regressive - grandparentish" - more cathedralish whining about the global system of strict-father supremacy


newyorker | Many reviewers have accused Chua and Rubenfeld of racism. In my experience of the book, that’s not fair: the idea isn’t that Asian-Americans, for example, are genetically predisposed to succeed, but that Asian immigrant culture encourages it. (In fact, Chua and Rubenfeld warn, drive fades with time, as immigrant cultures assimilate.) Still, the book is profoundly regressive—grandparentish, as it were—in the way in which it generalizes so freely about the inner lives of millions of people, always in a stereotypical way, while reducing the twists and turns of history to pop-psychological fate. My family, in proposing its wacky theory about the Chinese and the Jews, at least did so with a wink. But Chua and Rubenfeld are comically enamored of their idea and, like Mario with his hammer in Donkey Kong, they run around swinging their Triple Package at everything. Why do so many Nigerians earn doctorates? The Triple Package. Why did Bernie Madoff steal all that money? The Triple Package. (“At the extreme, the longing to rise can become desperate or monomaniacal.”) Why did the United States prosper so much during the nineteenth and twentieth centuries? “America was for a long time the quintessential Triple Package nation.” 

The fact that Chua and Rubenfeld can use the Triple Package to explain so much is a warning sign. It’s an idea so general that it can’t be contained. They want to declare the I-feel-special-but-also-inadequate part of the Triple Package the property of only a few select cultures. But, as Freud could have told you, pretty much everybody feels simultaneously special and inadequate. Lots of people, from all sorts of places, are pressured and judged by their parents, and end up slightly weird as a result. Chua and Rubenfeld point to America’s discourse of self-esteem and self-help, which, they write, encourages “embracing yourself as you are” and “feeling secure about yourself,” as evidence that non-immigrant Americans are relatively free of parent-induced neuroses. But that’s exactly the wrong conclusion to draw: if self-help is so pervasive, it’s because there are few feelings more common than insecurity. Fighting to realize or resist parental expectation is just part of the family experience.

Chua and Rubenfeld are drawn to psychological explanations because they can’t accept the idea that the third part of their Triple Package—”impulse control,” by which they basically mean working hard in school—could really be doing all the heavy lifting. Stuyvesant, one of New York’s most selective public high schools, uses a standardized admissions exam; last year, they write, the school admitted “nine black students, twenty-four Hispanics, a hundred seventy-seven whites and six hundred twenty Asians.” What, they ask, could possibly account for that outcome? Why didn’t all sorts of families, and not just Asian ones, send their kids to cram school to study for the Stuyvesant entrance exam? They regard the usual explanation, that Asian-Americans have an “education culture,” as circular. (Where does that “education culture” come from?) “The challenge is to delve deeper and discover the cultural roots of this behavior—to identify the fundamental cultural forces that underlie it,” they write. The Triple Package seems like a plausible candidate for such a force.

The thing is, though, that, often, cultures really are circular. All the time, communities judge their members by standards that are, on some level, arbitrary. In some families, what matters is military service. In others, it’s religious adherence. There are communities in which the family drama of aspiration and achievement is played out on the athletic field, with families spending evenings and weekends driving from game to game. To understand why a dad yells at his kid at Little League, you don’t have to point to a “fundamental cultural force” that makes him care so much about baseball. You just have to know that parents are very invested in their children, and that a community is a group of people who happen to care about the same things—sometimes for good reasons, and sometimes for no reason. Ask the Little League dad why sports are so important, and you’re likely to hear some hocus-pocus about the values of teamwork and good sportsmanship. The most accurate answer, probably, is “just because.”

43 comments:

Tom said...

So to recap, you have been unable so far to provide any data at all linking race to IQ genetically.

CNu said...

In the modern era, theology is the equivalent of My Little Pony. Did you run up a mortgage studying "theology" with the sole and exclusive intention of nailing down a 6-figure gig as a member of the professorial elite? If not, then this doesn't apply to you and I can't even imagine how you would think that it does. If this buster's biological clock is ticking, then he needs to man the phuk up and implement a back up plan involving his advanced degrees and some creation science or other sundry hucksterism that moves some kit$.

I would've dated myself more purely and castigated dungeons and dragons nerds, but there is something uniquely pathetic about the brony, so much so, that you took it as fighting words

John Kurman said...

Ah, I see. you focused on professor of theology while I drilled down adjunct. It's true that we aren't treated like shit the way a filipina maid in Qatar is, or a bracero worker in 1950s Texas was, but, in a way, we adjuncts point to the future of labor. Eventually, those of us not replaced by robots are all gonna be part-timers with no benefits, so that's the perceived slight I'm bitchin' about.

CNu said...

Having touched on the collapsarian economics of higher-ed often enough and long enough - I'm not tracking on how anybody could be confused about that handbasket's trajectory straight to hell. http://subrealism.blogspot.com/search?q=colleges. I won't further belabor the point by dwelling on technology and 21st century education delivery and what that portends for the "sage on the stage" model.

Anyway, the adjunct is your steady day job whilst you get established as a working artist pre-collapse, and master sword-smith post collapse....,(^;

Vic78 said...

Are Asian kids getting diagnosed the same? If not, why? My guess is the parents don't play that shit. I'm going to make another guess and say that sitting at a school desk without recess is probably boring. Then we have the shit that passes for a diet in this country. Maybe the kids instinctively know they're dealing with some bullshit sitting at that desk all day. If the future follows present trends, kids' time is being wasted.

Parents agreeing to have their kids on that shit need their asses whupped. We don't know the long term effects but they need it to pass 5th grade? Kids seem able to focus when they're doing something they like. What the fuck is wrong with our present crop of parents?

CNu said...

Bears repeating;

the parents don't play that shit
the parents don't play that shit
the parents don't play that shit

Some
doctors admit to prescribing Adderall and other ADHD drugs to
low-income kids, not because they have a disorder but just to
help them do better in school
. “We might not know the
long-term effects, but we do know the short-term costs of school
failure, which are real,” a pediatrician told the New York
Times.If the school sucks, and you drug your kid to
compensate for a situation that sucks, whose interest/benefit do you
call yourself serving?!?!?!?!?!? Is the free "daycare" really worth a lifetime of frustration and pain for your kids?


When you and I went to school, there was recess, PE, art, instrumental music, and decent tasting food in the lunch cafeteria made by the lunch ladies in hairnets who knew what they were doing. Nowadays, it's Sodexo phukking up something as simple as macaroni and cheese.

ken said...

"do your boneheaded cronies a favor by hipping them to the new developments in understanding devilish details related to the marvelous nutrient-shaped, nutrient-seeking, macro-molecular machinery."

Becoming hip to the complexities of the molecular machinery began quite some time ago in the ignorant crowd you have categorized. Even back in 1977 Creation Research Society was having a little reflection time on this. Can't say I am proficient in arguing or debating at this level, but I get the thrust of the article.

http://www.creationresearch.org/crsq/articles/14/14_1/enzymes/enzymes.html

DD said...

I've personally rejected the collapse narrative; feels more like a slide back into a caste system drawn along social, regional, and ethnic lines.


While this guy is a whiny jackass, the real problem is maybe-maybe-10% of the population actually needs to work for the current amount of material goods to be created and distributed.


What's happening is that as money is more and more divorced from being a reward for adding value to society, goods are distributed less and less for adding value. So raw power, class collusion and corruption are now the methods to best acquire wealth. Not that it's worse than it was 100 years ago or any time before that for the past several millennia, but the pendulum is swinging back that way.

CNu said...

the real problem is maybe-maybe-10% of the population actually needs to
work for the current amount of material goods to be created and
distributed.

lol, and the other 90% just eats, fucks, and propagates because they'll be needed to fill up the interstellar star arks that will carry the human race across the cosmos now being surveilled for habitable exoplanets http://science.nasa.gov/astrophysics/focus-areas/exoplanet-exploration/

Nah dood, sorry, that dog don't hunt. Shit's about to get incredibly bloody and real all over the place, all at once, and there's a real question mark hovering around whether or not it can or will be controlled, i.e., will there be survivors.

CNu said...

No Ken, what you get is a scholastic attack mounted against an old tautology stuck in the then current understanding. Nearly 40 years have passed since that fumbling attempt. Please take a moment to familiarize yourself with the concept of symbiogenesis, it's primary expositor the late and phenomenal Lynn Margulis, and how it elegantly and demonstrably solves the false problem set up by the boneheads in `77. http://subrealism.blogspot.com/search?q=symbiogenesis

Vic78 said...

Yes, Chua can get it. http://youtu.be/ntjInQJeMQI

CNu said...

All I want to do is contribute to
the scholarship in my field and to teach my students effectively and
passionately. But I need to earn a decent wage in order to do so.



smdh....., I'm not even sure this one rises to the level of a brony

DD said...

Well, that's certainly a worldview.


I think I've taken the necessary minimum insurance against that, but as they say, being early is the same as being wrong. 7 billion people are going to do everything they can to prevent your scenario, it may happen but that many people can keep a lead balloon up for a long time, and set it down more gently than you'd expect.Still, strong social connections and a charismatic personality go much farther than a basement of beans and bullets. Or so I think; it's a pass or fail test, so we all shall see.

Ed Dunn said...

"I published a book" and "I'm broke" is kind of an oxymoron....

BigDonOne said...

Failure to recognize that group differences are hopelessly hard-wired has real consequences for the nation. Billion$$ are squandered on education "reforms" trying to equalize group outcomes, and the only net affect on gap closure has been illusory -- the better performers have been suppressed, rather than elevating the IQ-75z. Better for the country to focus the resources where maximum potential exists. The Truth is not always a pleasant thing.....

CNu said...

It was a book within his selected field aimed at other theology scholars. Total possible worldwide readership not to exceed 2000 other bronies...,

CNu said...

Under the endless fall of available energy, all organizations will disintegrate, because "energy" (broadly defined) is the glue that holds organizations together.

As far as gathering allies for the storm, it's impossible to know how anyone individual would act if their society collapsed because this behavior is almost entirely based upon subliminal algorithms - not free-will-type, conscious decisions. What we can know for certain is that 7 Billion humans will revert to killer-ape subliminal algorithms and these not only don't prevent my scenario, they ensure my scenario.



That said, intelligent judgements can be made about "groups." The Mormons are a tiger culture. The Church and State in Utah are the same people. That will give it a lot of staying power. It's too late for you to apply your salesmanship, convert to Mormonism, and move to Salt Lake City. They're not going to buy it.

The Roman Catholic Church is the only organization to survive the collapse of Imperial Rome. I've made my charismatic affiliation decision.

The “collapse” of a country is caused by too many people competing for too few resources. When a country can not supply enough resources to satisfy its members, that country becomes unstable and subject to fundamental change.

Back to your 7 Billion hail Mary wishful thinking, the human mind serves “fitness” – not “truth.” Since every individual is programmed to pursue personal fitness and lie about intentions, no civilization has ever been able to convince its members to cooperate enough to survive the depletion of the energy resources which gave it birth. When confronted with ever-declining resources, the preservation of social order requires more-and-more cooperation, but individuals are genetically programmed to reduce cooperation and seek advantage. This genetic legacy sets up a positive feedback loop: declining common resources cause individuals to reduce cooperation even more, which reduces common resources even faster, which leads to collapse even faster.

Society only directs our behavior when we perceive that it is able to reward or punish us. A “collapsed” society has no influence over our behavior. That’s why cultures disappear and people revert to more violent ways of life.

Our present society began to collapse years ago because of the rising costs of energy. We include others in our society when we feel that it increases our fitness to do so, but we invent excuses to kick minorities out of our society when resources are insufficient. Allies can become enemies almost overnight. The collapse of Yugoslavia is an example - neighbor slaughtered neighbor, almost overnight. Ukraine is next and others will shortly follow.

DD said...

How many years have I been coming here? 5?6? I'm hip with the prognosis, and I don't think you are wrong in the long run. I did wander into the sewing circle from Hypertiger after all, he makes you look cheerful!


I just find the idea of sudden collapse unlikely. I've converted to the Archdruid's school of thought.


I suppose, depending on how it goes down, sudden collapse might be good for us 'Mericans; I just see it as the least likely outcome, it's too theatrical and nobody prospers from it. I see more of the same, only worse and more unfair, gradually going in waves over a hundred years or so.



Predictions wrong or your money back.

CNu said...

Unless you get some rain, you'll be in one of the early "adopter" test cases. I predict that no matter how bad things get, there won't be any continental shelf hydrology to the rescue. http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7478/full/nature12858.html

Vic78 said...

Here you go.
http://youtu.be/qCeHSGlZ2aM

Vic78 said...

So you're saying he should get in something like this: http://youtu.be/ABEBa-xR__4?

ken said...

I was looking through the stuff, and I realize you are posting it for the very casual reader, but how does new information get added. This can describe a way of spreading present primitive information, I am guessing primitive, because bacteria is pretty low and considered pretty basic in terms of evolutionary advancement, And let's say for the sake of argument that the merging of two functioning things, or genomes (hope that's what they are) into one, what really are the chances the new organism survives, and survives with new advanced information? It's gotta be really slim.
I also am not seeing anybody claiming this method or showing any evidence that this has caused macro-evolution via symbiogenesis. I'll let my ignorance show way out there,,,Is it possible to have an organism inherit new advanced genes from the lesser genomes that merged together to make the more advanced organism?

CNu said...

Loyola Marymount has demonstrated to him for 12 years that it doesn't value what he does. He needs to get his paper up before his wife's eggs all go bad and the bank seizes his ancestral manor. He has no Walter White skills. What's a brony who studies my little ponies to do?

CNu said...

Not only possible mutinoid caucasoid, but it's the only game in town. If you have a library card, I'd recommend using it and reading everything written and popularly published by Lynn Margulis http://subrealism.blogspot.com/2010/04/strong-biology.html

You grossly and egregiously underestimate the sophistication of your forbears and what they do http://subrealism.blogspot.com/2010/04/sources-of-heritable-novelty.html

BigDonOne said...

Important to stay focused here. Murray et. al. might find some interesting content in this New Database... http://www.activistpost.com/2014/02/johns-hopkins-introduces-database-of.html
The article alludes to this potential in a reference to Cold Spring Harbor, a eugenics PRR facility....

Dale Asberry said...

That's right Don, it is important to stay focused...


To begin with, the article only links MRI brain scans to 5000 children. There is absolutely no mention of "race", there is no mention of "IQ", and there is no mention of "heritability". MRI scanners create HUGE magnetic fields. Even small magnetic fields create very large electrical fields. So... even though MRIs give interesting information about physical structure, they essentially overwhelm the electrical field functioning in the brain and do not measure brain function. fMRI scans on the other hand measure blood flow which can be used as a crude analog to electrical function. It's considered crude because it can only detect blood flow changes in large areas of the brain. An analogue would be to measure the temperature on the surface of a computer chip when it does extreme number crunching. Sure, you quickly deduce where the APU lives but it indicates *nothing* about the internal switches in a CPU, let alone the physical structure of the switches. The point being is that there is a lot of disconnected information that is too macro-sized to make any kind of predictive correlation on the micro-sized machinery (neurons, DNA, RNA, etc.) of the brain.

Dale Asberry said...

Lolololol @ "Thus, while we must applaud scientific developments such as this one, we must also be vigilant to ensure that such developments are not used to surveil and enslave instead of creating increased freedom and improvement in our standards of living."

Vic78 said...

You've been outclassed. Your failure to even address my questions demonstrates adherence to an agenda.

http://youtu.be/zKhEw7nD9C4

CNu said...

Cain't you just let a old man stretch out, spread-eagled in his panties, smackdab in the middle of the schwarze sonne swaddled in the mysteries of his faith in peace? Is that really too much to ask?!?!?!?!? http://youtu.be/YTJUaTGgCRU?t=5m26s


Gottdayyum'd disrespectful devils every.single.one.of.you

Vic78 said...

I figured he could be a consultant for future Bible movies, he could work with the History Channel, he could write a book arguing against current speculation about King David and Jonathan's alleged sexual relationship, he could write anthologies, another thing would be to figure out how Emerson discovered fire, he could go in on tv preachers, and there are other ways he could use the doctorate and masters if he tightened that thinking cap. What's worse is that he lives in LA. There are a million and one ways for a PhD to come up. There must be something in their training that kills off hustle bones.

CNu said...

Being the authoritative sage on the stage in front of a class of fresh young minds has a great deal to be said for it, and if you're tenured and paid, damn near no downside whatsoever. All that other grown man stuff involves risk, challenges, and the very high probability of several rounds of failure. It's taken me five years to fully recover from my last entrepreneurial endeavor, but I wouldn't trade those hard knocks for anything.

makheru bradley said...

It appears to me that as highly educated as these parents were, they were not prepared and did not prepare their children to deal with institutionalized white supremacy at the elite level.

Paraphrasing a few quotes:

95 percent of the Black children at this school have problems and I don’t understand it.

He’s not going to be dealt with like a white child.

We put our children in this environment and if they are seeing it now, what perception are they going to have of themselves. Is this something that is going to help them or hinder them in the future.

Idris has been to 20 Bar Mitzvahs and the Jewish girls will not dance with him. Why did his parents keep subjecting him to this?

Young Idris asks his parents, if I were white would I be better off at this school.

A counselor says Seun is peaceful and thoughtful, but Dalton is not peaceful. Obviously, the white students there are being prepared to rule the world. They learn targeted aggression early.

Dalton administrator says there is a cultural disconnect between Afrikan American boys and independent schools and we see a high rate of these boys not being successful.

Banneker teacher says, white people don’t see a need for diversity, why do we.

CNu said...

Idris has been to 20 Bar Mitzvahs and the Jewish girls will not dance with him. Why did his parents keep subjecting him to this?


Sad to say Bro. Makheru, but from what I'm looking at here, young Idris is sadly lacking in "game".



Not bragging here, but level-setting. Lil'Nu Jr. (age 14) and a full inche taller than me now - has not only been to a fair number of bar mitzvahs, but a fair number of WASP soirees - and the pink toes are lined up 3-5 deep for his "attentions". It's reached the point where he's had enough - and is more than a little disgusted with/by the ease of the objective. So now he's set his sights on 17-18 year old scholar athletes, straight-edges, who hold themselves to a much higher standard of personal self-discipline and esteem - and who have driver's licenses and cars.

Vic78 said...

Young Idris' parents didn't see the need to instill that game. I don't know why Black parents still believe that "arrived" narrative. All that gives us is a generation of corn balls. I don't expect much from the "best and brightest" nowadays.

makheru bradley said...

I'm sure you've already had that "playa" discussion. Obviously we did not see the complete Idris, but it appears that his buppie parents sheltered him. I hope he adjusts to college life at Occidental and life in Cali. A friend of mine (single mother who was still getting her groove on) was overbearing with her daughter. This girl could not even receive phone calls at times. The young lady got a track scholarship to a HBCU in NC. Released from the constraints of her mother, she promptly went buck wild and was pregnant by her sophomore year.

BigDonOne said...

Asian families hold themselves to the highest family value standards. Minimal OOW_Breeding and miscegenation. They tend to concern themselves with education and long-term success, not immediate gratification. Would suspect few Asian kids would even recognize the term, "game..." let alone development of the associated "skills..." Pays off, big time......

makheru bradley said...

Good luck on Capitol Hill, Dr. Greenberg, where over 50 percent of the elected officials are millionaires. This is the modus operandi for corporate America. Eliminate full-time employees with benefits and replace them with part-time or temporary workers. This is basically a 30 year trend, and people are still spending $100K+ for a liberal arts education hoping to get lucky.

For better than 100 years the oligarchic psychopathocracy believed that a growing and stable middle-class was vital to their security. Now with the NSA, a militarized police force, G4S, Academi, etc., they are saying “F” the middle-class.

Vic78 said...

Man, you have to respect it. If you have a daughter you might want to let her know about some "game."

http://youtu.be/TL6-6qFLRII

ken said...

I never see ADHD ever discussed in connection with lack of sleep. Years ago I used to have a daycare, and when I dropped various items off at the parents house around 10 or something I was surprised at how many of the kids were up or fell asleep in front of the TV when the rest of the people were just yucking it up. My small example observations seemed to have the same kids that weren't under a consistent sleep regiment were also the ones acting up with me and having trouble at school.

I am betting that there are also other kids who have consistent schedules for sleep, but might have other sleep issues. With that said, I am sure my backyard theory is all of it, because more boys get labeled yet woman seem to report sleep insomnia ore than men. But there is some stats to make one look into it if he's got a kid being diagnosed.

http://www.sleepfoundation.org/article/sleep-topics/adhd-and-sleep

Dale Asberry said...

"Game" is what it takes to land high-value women. Period. It's the "dance" of attraction. You don't teach your son game and you aren't maximizing the potential of your grandchildren. Don't teach your daughter game and she'll be taken in by a highly engaging but low-value man which at best minimizes the potential of your grandchildren and at worst allows your daughter to be abused.

Tom said...

With all due respect, sure this "game" stuff is real ... but all the emphasis is on "winning" the objective and almost no attention is paid to picking the right objective.


Reminds me of politics -- as practiced by the "teams" not necessarily the leaders. Everything is about winning a narrowly defined contest. Nobody talks about recognizing what game you're in and its real-world imperatives and what you really get if you "win."


On this issue I'm closest to BD's position.

Tom said...

Aha, except for BD "miscegenation" is a big negative ... and presumably he means mixing of races. I'm much more worried about mixing of what our host calls "neurotypes."

I mean, sure, my hindbrain will start chewing the carpets if my daughter dates out of her tribe, but you have to have some freaking priorities.

Uglyblackjohn said...

Wow Don? thanks for that link. I didn't realize that white people had so little to worry about (as far as being a victim of crime) and that white women were the LEAST desirable among rapists.

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